1
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Roll five.

2
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Hello my friends and welcome to Retro Dogfight.

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I almost said the other one.

4
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The podcast where old guys talk about old flight sims.

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I of course am your cohost Brian and joining me as always is your cohost Chase and your
cohost Denny.

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Reporting for duty, sir.

7
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And folks, a bit of housekeeping today.

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We are using a new platform to record our podcasts.

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For the last year and even longer with my other podcasts, Space Game Junkie, we were using
Discord.

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We would log into Discord, use one of their voice rooms, and I would record over
VoiceMeeter Banana.

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I would record a WAV file on VoiceMeeter Banana and use Audacity to edit it and whatnot.

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And so it was completely dependent on me to edit and

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regulate the volume and everything.

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But someone in uh our retro dogfight community, Trickster, recommended this platform
called Riverside.

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I can talk.

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Riverside.

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It is a web-based platform in which the platform records individually from our machines as
we talk.

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And then it uploads and makes a lovely audio file from each of the individual tracks.

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But it also gives the individual tracks, which is nice if I needed that sort of thing.

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so this show might sound a little different because we were using a different platform.

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and I hope it sounds better for y'all.

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I think it does.

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It sounds better on the other show.

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so I'm excited.

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This platform is, it's got some really nice features and it gets us one step away from
using discord because let's be honest, excuse my language.

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Discord is becoming a little bit more and shitified of late.

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so it's, it's good to kind of bit by bit, maybe separate ourselves from discord if we need
to.

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Um, so yeah, this, this, uh, Riverside is very nice.

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I will tell you all one thing.

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It's worth the money.

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The, the Riverside costs money, uh, because we have a hand raising function.

32
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So on the other show.

33
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gonna use it, I'm just gonna talk right, sorry.

34
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same here.

35
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Absolutely.

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it.

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Well, we have it if anyone ever wants to use it.

38
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It's very nice.

39
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I love it.

40
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But you know what?

41
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Fine.

42
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I can't make anybody do anything, but it's fine.

43
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um And I'm a little coffee today.

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I'm going to try and like mute the mic if I, if I try and do that while I'm talking, I'm a
little, got something.

45
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It's not a cold, but I got something.

46
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So I apologize for that in advance.

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So friends today, since we,

48
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Left behind the notion of going chronologically and are starting to jump around a little
bit like the song says uh, we just well I decided because I because I my brain wasn't

49
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working and i'm like, let's just do this We're going to talk about our favorite sims.

50
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Uh, and that's going to be in chronological order And so we're starting with mine 1991's
gunship 2000 if you are not aware

51
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Gunship 2000 is the sequel to 1986's Gunship.

52
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It's got more theaters, more helicopters, more features.

53
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It's got a lot to it.

54
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There's a lot, a lot to this game.

55
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And it has become, I didn't play it back in the day because I didn't like Gunship.

56
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And so I missed it.

57
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But after starting to play it four years ago, I think,

58
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It has become my favorite flight sim for a variety of reasons, which we will get into.

59
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So, um, that's why I wanted to talk about it because I love this slit sim slash game.

60
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So very much.

61
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It just does it tickles all my boxes.

62
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It checks.

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just does everything I want.

64
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And I'm sorry about that.

65
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It does everything I want in a flight sim.

66
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and I just, I just love it so much.

67
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Um,

68
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So let me ask you guys, did you guys play this at all back in the day?

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this actually came out kind of before my PC flight sim awakening period.

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So the earliest memories I have of it are, um, my, had, that was when I was in the Navy
living with a bunch of roommates in a big old house.

71
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And we just kind of had a crap room where we threw all of our stuff in.

72
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Uh, one of my roommates was another PC gamer and he had a bunch in there and I was just
going through his, he's like, go, go through the games to see if there's anything you want

73
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to play.

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Cause we'd swap games back and forth.

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And he had a copy of this, we never played it.

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And I took a look at it, but it was like just the, I was not into the whole cost of entry
kind of thing by that, meaning I was not in the mindset back then of wanting to crack open

77
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a manual.

78
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I just wanted to launch the game and have fun.

79
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So I never, so I came across it, could have played it, but just chose not to.

80
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That's fair.

81
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What about you, Danny?

82
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Um, so I was working at compute magazine at that point and I was managing the game reviews
and when it came out and I remember cracking it open, uh, was tried everything first, see

83
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if I wanted to do it myself and my reaction was, ew.

84
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And I sent it to P I think it was Peter Olufsen, to do the review.

85
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Um,

86
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Yeah, it was not my cup.

87
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Did I hear you say that you didn't play this till four years ago?

88
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You liked this in the 21st century.

89
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We are different gamers,

90
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Love it.

91
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Love it.

92
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No.

93
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So let me, let me, let me give you the story real quick.

94
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Um, so after I played in my every part of this, so after I played F 19, fell in love with
it.

95
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F 90 was my first micro pros game.

96
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And, you know, of course it's still one of my favorites.

97
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I love F 19.

98
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I wouldn't like good.

99
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was, what was the first MicroProse games?

100
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Mine is, what about you, Danny?

101
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Mine was Silent Service on the Commodore 64.

102
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good one.

103
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I'm not sure if it was absolutely the first, but the first one that I remember playing
was, um, solo flight, which was the really simple civilian flight simulation, um, that

104
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they did like back in the early C 64 days.

105
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That's a good one though, I've played that a little bit recently here and there.

106
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It still holds up with it's like, gotta get the mail on time thing going.

107
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Yeah, it's good.

108
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Yeah, it's really good.

109
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that was early Sid Meier flight simming.

110
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Yeah, yeah, that's good stuff.

111
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to be honest, the copy I had of Silent Service was a friendly copy, so no manual.

112
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I was in most of those games, unless it was like a dumb arcade game where you could just
figure it out immediately, I would just put it aside.

113
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But Silent Service was like, I figured it out.

114
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I pressed the keys to make it work.

115
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I loved that game.

116
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Oh, Silent Service is so good.

117
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The second one is maybe is one of my favorite subsims of all time.

118
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That and Red Storm Rising are like my two like tied for favorite subsims like ever.

119
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my God.

120
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I love them both.

121
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Anyway, so I, as after I fell in love with F-19, I'm like, these guys have other flight
sims.

122
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I will go back and try them.

123
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And I played Gunship, was terrible at it.

124
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Just absolutely awful at it.

125
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So I'm like, nope, nope, this is not for me.

126
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And then I saw Gunship 2000 come out.

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like, I didn't like the first one.

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I'm not going to play the second one.

129
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I skipped it.

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Completely skipped it.

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And it was only a few years ago once I, played after uh Tiny Combat Arena came out.

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I was like, you know, I've never visited all these old flight sims, even ones I skipped
back in the day.

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And so I played Gunship 2000 for the first time.

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Like, my God, this does everything I want.

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It's a flight sim.

136
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It's got the random missions of like F-19, but it's like,

137
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almost entirely air to ground stuff.

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When you level up, you have other uh guys to command.

139
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You could fly a Blackhawk and do like cargo deliveries and search and rescue.

140
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You got recon.

141
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You got like this guy's everything.

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So the more I played it, the more I wrote, the more just I fell in love with it.

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And then, and now it's become my favorite flights in ever because it's got everything I
love.

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Yeah, and I bounced off it um back in the day and a lot of that had to do not as much with
the games as I've just never been a helicopter guy.

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I like fixed wings and forward momentum, but um I do have to say, having edited the review
and knowing about the game, um on paper, this thing does so many things amazingly well.

146
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does.

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had something, it wasn't a dynamic campaign, but how you perform in the campaign reflects
what you see on your mission briefings and your overall score.

148
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It's like, you know, it's not just individual missions that don't affect each other.

149
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Yeah.

150
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Yeah.

151
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And I'm sure.

152
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early dynamic camp, very early, sorry to interrupt, very early proto dynamic thing.

153
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Yeah.

154
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But yeah.

155
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Yeah, yeah, and the commanding multiple helicopters thing like this was when wingmen were
just starting to come in the game.

156
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that was super cool and I'm sure you'll go into that.

157
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So there's so much that is impressive about this.

158
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The reason I bounced off it then was I'm just like, I'd rather fly airplanes.

159
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It was that simple.

160
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Trying to get back into it now for the podcast and I did, you can buy this legitimately
now on Steam.

161
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It was on sale for $6.99 when this was recorded.

162
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It might be 10 bucks.

163
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It's worth it.

164
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You get Gunship and Gunship 2000.

165
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You get all the patches thanks to one of our co-hosts.

166
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And it's a really nice package.

167
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So I put some time into it.

168
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I can't get into it now because the terrain is so stone, knives and bearskins primitive.

169
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Um, that like you don't get any sense of altitude.

170
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You don't get any sense of height and it's, it's a step over the pyramid polygons of
gunship, but it's still not very much, very much detail.

171
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You can hide behind the, the eight sided polygon.

172
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Um, and, like nap of the earth and pop up stuff and everything, but it's just like, like
just a few years later, we had the longbow games.

173
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and the um stuff like the Comanche from Nova Logic that had the terrain that you need to
make a helicopter sound interesting.

174
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And it just, the world they built couldn't get me into it.

175
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Well, shows, go ahead, sorry.

176
00:11:05,597 --> 00:11:07,580
mean, I just to back Denny up.

177
00:11:07,580 --> 00:11:08,260
Yeah.

178
00:11:08,260 --> 00:11:13,504
Um, in terms of just back of the box features, it rocks.

179
00:11:13,604 --> 00:11:19,950
I mean, for crying out loud, is, it is essentially like Brian said, and I, I feel where
you're coming from there.

180
00:11:19,950 --> 00:11:22,351
It is absolutely everything you want.

181
00:11:22,351 --> 00:11:24,493
You have, you have a track career.

182
00:11:24,493 --> 00:11:33,380
Um, you have, you know, you earn your way up to wingman you, and you have a slew of
helicopters to fly and missions to accomplish.

183
00:11:33,496 --> 00:11:35,917
Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

184
00:11:35,917 --> 00:11:36,807
It is just perfect.

185
00:11:36,807 --> 00:11:41,498
But then I'm going to turn around and just I'm going to write in Denny's draft here.

186
00:11:41,498 --> 00:11:55,543
Yes, um the graphic presentation doesn't make, it doesn't live up to the rest of the game,
particularly in what I found was draw distance.

187
00:11:55,923 --> 00:11:59,564
If you're on top of something, they're on top of you when you spot them.

188
00:12:00,154 --> 00:12:09,699
you're never going to creep up on somebody almost 90 % of the time unaware because if they
can see you, you can see them and you're not going to maneuver towards specs on the

189
00:12:09,699 --> 00:12:15,913
horizon because that spec might just be a scaled sprite or something like that.

190
00:12:15,913 --> 00:12:21,906
do appreciate that they, MicroProse did a little something with the graphic engine over
F19.

191
00:12:21,906 --> 00:12:29,300
Now you can fly through these like river canyons and whatnot and these unrealistically
tall scale

192
00:12:29,436 --> 00:12:31,596
You know canyons that just drive me crazy.

193
00:12:31,596 --> 00:12:36,456
It's like there is there is no 1000 meter deep Canyon in Europe.

194
00:12:36,456 --> 00:12:47,676
Sorry guys The so the y scale is really distorted just so they can actually put something
on the screen But yeah, just a completely backup to just all the Denny's point.

195
00:12:47,676 --> 00:12:49,076
I'm with him.

196
00:12:49,076 --> 00:12:58,936
Hey, it's a it's a house fan sim I'm not into whirlybirds Unless they're done so well that
it's just amazing longbow gold

197
00:12:59,004 --> 00:13:05,973
um The graphics are just they're not there yet for low level nape of the earth.

198
00:13:05,973 --> 00:13:10,237
They could have done a lot more, think to to or what maybe could have.

199
00:13:10,237 --> 00:13:19,296
um But as far as where you're going, Brian, yeah, I mean everything otherwise you would
want in the SIM even in 2026.

200
00:13:20,353 --> 00:13:20,753
Yeah.

201
00:13:20,753 --> 00:13:36,257
And I'll say uh in their defense, as far as maybe could have, ah when I was looking back
at the compute review, ah the author mentions that it was very sluggish on a 10 megahertz

202
00:13:36,257 --> 00:13:36,898
machine.

203
00:13:36,898 --> 00:13:43,660
ah That it was much smoother, but a little jerky on the 33 megahertz machine.

204
00:13:43,660 --> 00:13:45,966
So I think it's

205
00:13:45,966 --> 00:13:46,559
man!

206
00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:57,365
Yeah, I think it's more a case of the hardware not being there to do the level of detail
they needed yet, ah rather than anything on their side.

207
00:13:57,632 --> 00:14:03,407
Well, what I wanted to say was this is a great example of how fast everything moved in the
nineties.

208
00:14:03,407 --> 00:14:07,522
I, I mean, you w this goes to what you were saying earlier.

209
00:14:07,522 --> 00:14:14,156
Uh, Denny was like, I show someone like to people who didn't fully express it.

210
00:14:14,156 --> 00:14:25,877
um, I'll show someone like something from like 1991, like gunship 2000, and then I'll show
them like tornado from like two years later, which is like such a step up.

211
00:14:25,877 --> 00:14:30,699
And then I'll show them Comanche and then I'll show them, you know, Jane's long bow.

212
00:14:30,699 --> 00:14:34,057
then I'll show them jet fighter three.

213
00:14:34,057 --> 00:14:45,123
And then it's like, like things moved so quickly in the nineties and, and, and, this was
like so early nineties, but yeah, they had to write a whole new engine for this because,

214
00:14:45,123 --> 00:14:50,335
uh, they wanted to use the F-19 engine, but it wouldn't give them the detail they wanted.

215
00:14:50,497 --> 00:14:52,210
ah as low as they wanted to go.

216
00:14:52,210 --> 00:14:53,762
So they had to write a whole new engine for this.

217
00:14:53,762 --> 00:14:57,547
At least that's what they said in either the manual or the strategy guide.

218
00:14:57,688 --> 00:15:03,217
There's an interview in the strategy guide um that talks about it or the manual, one of
the two.

219
00:15:03,217 --> 00:15:04,196
um

220
00:15:04,196 --> 00:15:06,767
one simple design decision I think would have helped.

221
00:15:06,767 --> 00:15:13,719
I mean, this had been done for a while, even in earlier Sims, what I call the dots on the
ground.

222
00:15:13,719 --> 00:15:24,913
If you guys know what I'm talking about, if you get closer to the ground, all of a sudden
you start seeing like dots, ah Red Baron did it and a bunch of other Sims do it.

223
00:15:24,913 --> 00:15:26,823
And I mean, it was something.

224
00:15:26,823 --> 00:15:29,824
ah I mean, they tried to do...

225
00:15:29,916 --> 00:15:37,456
In this engine, they tried to do different really primitive textures and fills, which,
yeah, and trees.

226
00:15:37,456 --> 00:15:40,276
But the trees are like 90 feet tall.

227
00:15:41,296 --> 00:15:50,016
And yeah, if they could have done something as simple, like I said, as you've seen before,
just maybe they just did, they shot themselves in the foot there just for the quote

228
00:15:50,016 --> 00:15:57,620
unquote realism reason, but just kind of that something to indicate that there's a
difference between 50 feet and 100 feet.

229
00:15:58,178 --> 00:16:00,844
Well, I will correct you on the riverbeds.

230
00:16:00,844 --> 00:16:03,290
They do only go down to about two or 300 feet.

231
00:16:03,290 --> 00:16:06,509
I know it looks bigger than that, but they do only go down to about...

232
00:16:06,509 --> 00:16:17,137
think one of the things that made me curse at the sim um was I was going to fly through
this canyon and I'm going to get to my primary target.

233
00:16:17,137 --> 00:16:29,316
The goddamn canyon just kept going forever and it's like 500, 600, 700 feet tall so it's
not like it's effort to fly over the top of it like there is no canyon like this in

234
00:16:29,316 --> 00:16:30,146
central Europe.

235
00:16:30,146 --> 00:16:31,307
am sorry.

236
00:16:31,553 --> 00:16:32,108
That's true.

237
00:16:32,108 --> 00:16:33,904
Okay, that's fair.

238
00:16:33,904 --> 00:16:41,490
there's a lot of exaggeration there to, you know, hey, wouldn't be flying through Canyon
to be cool, you know, which is fine.

239
00:16:41,490 --> 00:16:42,710
I mean they do that.

240
00:16:42,710 --> 00:16:49,906
I mean they say many times in their interviews that their focus was on fun, which is one
of the things I appreciate with this game.

241
00:16:49,906 --> 00:16:54,179
And that's why you can fly through a train tunnel in this game.

242
00:16:55,660 --> 00:17:01,326
Yeah, I tried to I didn't do a train pedal, but I did do a road canyon and I amuse myself.

243
00:17:01,326 --> 00:17:09,596
There's like a I don't I think it's on I don't know if it's on the central map or on the
Desert Storm one, but there's a road that cuts through and it goes up through a canyon.

244
00:17:09,596 --> 00:17:12,799
So it's just not like I was like, I was like, it's kind of fun.

245
00:17:13,485 --> 00:17:17,208
But, but yeah, but then they're talking about fun things like flying through tunnels.

246
00:17:17,208 --> 00:17:24,753
And then you have all of these detailed modeling for the time, different helicopters.

247
00:17:24,753 --> 00:17:31,417
So it feels a little Hydra there, like it's trying to got different heads doing different
things.

248
00:17:31,417 --> 00:17:38,181
Um, because there's, know, no, you have to have this helicopter to carry this weapon load.

249
00:17:39,062 --> 00:17:42,384
and, uh, yeah, I don't know.

250
00:17:42,384 --> 00:17:43,145
It's.

251
00:17:43,227 --> 00:17:48,237
It's no point asking Brian, but Denny, did you fly anything but the Apache?

252
00:17:48,690 --> 00:17:54,144
Yeah, I actually started out in the Huey Cobra.

253
00:17:54,728 --> 00:17:55,549
Yeah.

254
00:17:55,602 --> 00:18:01,017
I tried like, I tried the super cobras and whatnot.

255
00:18:01,017 --> 00:18:06,451
I'm just like, I don't need this old, you know, Tao armed Vietnam piece of crap.

256
00:18:06,451 --> 00:18:07,833
I am not going to fly this.

257
00:18:07,833 --> 00:18:11,476
So it was like, I, you know, I did some restraint.

258
00:18:11,476 --> 00:18:14,829
I didn't play the longbow.

259
00:18:14,829 --> 00:18:18,092
I just stuck with the Apache because that's enough to kill.

260
00:18:18,092 --> 00:18:18,822
yeah.

261
00:18:19,524 --> 00:18:23,899
you can't get the longbow, sorry to interrupt, you can't get the longbow until you rank up
to captain.

262
00:18:24,129 --> 00:18:25,753
Yeah, it unlocks later.

263
00:18:25,753 --> 00:18:27,751
uh

264
00:18:27,751 --> 00:18:32,728
I would disagree because if in Desert Storm you can't.

265
00:18:32,729 --> 00:18:39,276
But I found it was, well I didn't select it, but it was not grayed out or anything in
Central Europe.

266
00:18:39,467 --> 00:18:41,258
Yeah, it's supposed to be an unlockable.

267
00:18:41,258 --> 00:18:56,997
um But yeah, it's uh the other thing too, though, is that the helicopters, uh like they
basically differ in the bitmap image for the cockpit, which, you know, it's nice that it

268
00:18:56,997 --> 00:19:00,589
does try to reflect what it would look like to sit in each one.

269
00:19:00,589 --> 00:19:02,870
um They don't fly differently.

270
00:19:02,870 --> 00:19:05,612
Not that much.

271
00:19:05,612 --> 00:19:08,185
And the difference between flying uh

272
00:19:08,185 --> 00:19:14,671
you know, like a UH-60 and a H1W should be really stark.

273
00:19:14,671 --> 00:19:29,503
uh Brian Walker, um who at the time that he wrote the review of this for CGW, he was a CGW
reviewer and his CGW uh helicopter coverage ended up getting him a job producing

274
00:19:29,503 --> 00:19:30,464
helicopter games.

275
00:19:30,464 --> 00:19:36,487
um But he reviewed this for CGW back in 91.

276
00:19:36,581 --> 00:19:40,624
And he was a Apache pilot in Desert Storm.

277
00:19:40,624 --> 00:19:44,988
um So, so, so, so he knows his stuff.

278
00:19:44,988 --> 00:19:45,348
Yeah.

279
00:19:45,348 --> 00:19:50,572
In his review of the original game, he basically says it's the best helicopter game ever,
but it's still kind of sucks.

280
00:19:50,572 --> 00:20:04,153
uh The, the, um, the, he, he reviewed the expansion later and, uh, that one, he felt like,
um, you make sure that, you know, get the legit package folks because it's got all the

281
00:20:04,153 --> 00:20:05,036
expansions.

282
00:20:05,036 --> 00:20:08,476
And that doesn't just add the new theaters.

283
00:20:08,616 --> 00:20:11,076
It cleans up some of the control stuff.

284
00:20:11,896 --> 00:20:23,776
he liked, he actually did like the expansion a lot better, but his big complaint was that
all of the helicopters, despite having all of them, they just all basically flew like an

285
00:20:23,776 --> 00:20:25,076
overloaded Huey.

286
00:20:26,059 --> 00:20:27,485
Yeah, pretty much.

287
00:20:27,485 --> 00:20:28,445
Pretty much.

288
00:20:28,445 --> 00:20:33,182
And because he was talking about all the cool things you can do in a real long bow and you
can't do them in the set.

289
00:20:33,845 --> 00:20:34,685
Yeah.

290
00:20:35,306 --> 00:20:35,857
Yeah.

291
00:20:35,857 --> 00:20:41,752
I don't know if that was a limitation of the time or they were just trying to keep it
accessible or what.

292
00:20:41,911 --> 00:20:44,815
Did either of you try the realistic flight model?

293
00:20:44,815 --> 00:20:50,940
Because I'm going to be honest, this is the SIM that taught me that I can't really do
realistic flight models.

294
00:20:50,940 --> 00:20:52,161
I can't.

295
00:20:53,589 --> 00:20:56,584
and wind and just went noped.

296
00:20:56,584 --> 00:20:57,795
I noped out.

297
00:20:57,816 --> 00:21:05,068
And I went back to no wind and uh normal or the easy flight mode.

298
00:21:05,265 --> 00:21:05,898
Yeah.

299
00:21:05,898 --> 00:21:07,337
the realistic one.

300
00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:10,136
hardcore.

301
00:21:10,136 --> 00:21:11,891
stem pilot, Jesus, guys.

302
00:21:11,891 --> 00:21:13,763
I know that's great though.

303
00:21:13,804 --> 00:21:19,213
They did say that they tried to ease it up from the realistic flight mode of the original
gunship.

304
00:21:19,213 --> 00:21:23,540
That was a thing because even they thought that was a little too challenging.

305
00:21:23,540 --> 00:21:26,043
So they eased it up a little bit in this one.

306
00:21:26,043 --> 00:21:27,048
um

307
00:21:27,048 --> 00:21:39,686
mean, it's a little challenging, but after trying to do anything in the Horibet
helicopters and the current versions of Microsoft Flight Sim, em those might be flyable if

308
00:21:39,686 --> 00:21:47,861
you have like a collective control and other stuff, but trying to do it with a normal
hodas like throttle and they like, my God, I've killed myself so many times trying to

309
00:21:47,861 --> 00:21:49,001
master those.

310
00:21:49,001 --> 00:21:54,054
So this just seemed like, you know, arcade mode and realism compared to that crap.

311
00:21:54,530 --> 00:22:08,388
um So, so yeah, I this I try I wanted to do the realistic mode because in the manual I
mean the strategy guide and whatnot the the designer of the developer is like get to

312
00:22:08,388 --> 00:22:16,602
realistic most use you can you could do so much more in realistic mode and So I tried and
I'm like my brain cannot split my focus like this.

313
00:22:16,602 --> 00:22:18,443
I can't do it I just can't do it.

314
00:22:18,443 --> 00:22:19,464
My brain can't do it.

315
00:22:19,464 --> 00:22:21,980
um I've had a little

316
00:22:21,980 --> 00:22:25,455
to fly because the Dan collective is on the keyboard.

317
00:22:25,455 --> 00:22:27,446
Yeah.

318
00:22:27,940 --> 00:22:29,409
It's like the plus and minus keys.

319
00:22:29,409 --> 00:22:37,657
And yeah, if I could have used the throttle or anything, it would help a lot for being
able to maneuver it.

320
00:22:38,098 --> 00:22:40,210
Cause trying the joystick and keyboard.

321
00:22:41,025 --> 00:22:43,737
joysticks have throttles in 91.

322
00:22:44,497 --> 00:22:45,809
OK.

323
00:22:46,531 --> 00:22:49,374
CH had like a little dial throttle on one of theirs.

324
00:22:49,374 --> 00:22:54,740
ah I think it CH, but I remember having one back in the really early days.

325
00:22:54,740 --> 00:23:02,508
And uh yeah, it feels like the Thrustmaster and CH models came out about that time too.

326
00:23:02,817 --> 00:23:10,017
Okay, because my first CH was 93, I got it for X-Wing and I remember the little throttle
dial on that one, but I didn't have a throttle dial.

327
00:23:10,017 --> 00:23:13,897
I didn't have any kind of throttle before that, so I wasn't sure.

328
00:23:14,897 --> 00:23:16,857
Yeah, that is tough.

329
00:23:16,857 --> 00:23:24,717
I don't know if there's a way to map the collective to a throttle and maybe use VJoy or
one of those things.

330
00:23:24,717 --> 00:23:25,437
I don't know.

331
00:23:25,437 --> 00:23:26,997
I don't know if that's possible.

332
00:23:27,977 --> 00:23:29,257
Excuse me.

333
00:23:29,633 --> 00:23:31,673
Yeah, I really, I did try.

334
00:23:31,673 --> 00:23:34,193
I did make an attempt to fly this unrealistic more than once.

335
00:23:34,193 --> 00:23:35,473
And I'm like, I can't do this.

336
00:23:35,473 --> 00:23:36,985
I just can't do this.

337
00:23:37,786 --> 00:23:41,657
Yeah, I'm kind of in the same boat and that's why I bounced off.

338
00:23:41,657 --> 00:23:51,600
Even the really good Helicopter Sims, it's just too much chewing bubble gum and walking at
the same time and it's so unintuitive for me.

339
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:53,140
So I kept it.

340
00:23:53,140 --> 00:23:57,931
And honestly, know, there's nothing you really...

341
00:23:57,931 --> 00:24:04,123
Again, that's just going to go back to, again, a great set of features, but the core
gameplay is kind of meh.

342
00:24:04,123 --> 00:24:07,924
I don't think there's anything advanced that you need to do.

343
00:24:08,174 --> 00:24:14,246
I mean, considering that I found the gameplay, which was fine, I didn't hate it.

344
00:24:14,246 --> 00:24:22,428
The gameplay seems to be just take off, get to 60, 70 feet, creepy crawl to your target.

345
00:24:22,428 --> 00:24:24,709
As soon as you spot them, they'll spot you.

346
00:24:24,709 --> 00:24:29,070
So you need to cycle over to what weapon you need to hit them with.

347
00:24:29,070 --> 00:24:30,180
Hit them with the weapon.

348
00:24:30,180 --> 00:24:35,172
If they shoot back, try to beam whatever is shooting at you.

349
00:24:35,172 --> 00:24:37,122
And usually you'll get away with it.

350
00:24:37,250 --> 00:24:40,782
and then run out of fuel.

351
00:24:40,782 --> 00:24:41,552
And there you go.

352
00:24:41,552 --> 00:24:45,663
That's the game, gameplay for me anyway, over and over.

353
00:24:45,663 --> 00:25:05,492
um This made me go into my 86 box and install Longbow Gold and get hyped watching the
intro reel of them, poking the Longbow's radar over a hill to get lock on before launch

354
00:25:05,492 --> 00:25:06,692
and all of that.

355
00:25:06,768 --> 00:25:10,860
Wow, this makes me want to play, you know, longbow more than, you know, go back to this.

356
00:25:10,860 --> 00:25:14,012
So at least I'll probably go back and play that.

357
00:25:14,012 --> 00:25:27,590
But yeah, I mean, to me, the, again, so much neat stuff around it, but the gameplay just
not, it was a lot of just, you know, waiting until your fuel ran out, which I have a real

358
00:25:27,590 --> 00:25:29,711
gripe with how fuel is handled in this game.

359
00:25:29,711 --> 00:25:30,822
I understand that.

360
00:25:30,822 --> 00:25:32,452
I mean, it's specifically about that.

361
00:25:32,452 --> 00:25:33,763
Yeah, it's, it's limited.

362
00:25:33,763 --> 00:25:35,588
um

363
00:25:35,588 --> 00:25:46,493
you know, for gameplay reasons, but for crying out loud, you know, I shouldn't for a
target the next mountain over, I shouldn't be sweating my fuel, you know, but.

364
00:25:46,493 --> 00:25:47,238
hm.

365
00:25:48,426 --> 00:26:03,129
So, so Brian, obviously this did not resonate with with Jason I, but because you loved it
to rather than us get into like, like why 1991 didn't work for us for helicopter sales.

366
00:26:03,129 --> 00:26:10,611
Why can't like describe like some of the missions, some of the joy, some of the stuff that
that that made this your favorite sim.

367
00:26:10,611 --> 00:26:14,826
Like I want to hear the joy of Brian with this with this.

368
00:26:14,826 --> 00:26:23,091
it wasn't until the multi-flight, the multi helicopter flight opened up that it really
just hit my soul.

369
00:26:23,091 --> 00:26:27,613
Because one thing that amazes me, did you guys get to that point?

370
00:26:28,316 --> 00:26:35,316
You know, I probably put, I would say I put about a good 10 hours into this and I never
got beyond war an officer.

371
00:26:35,316 --> 00:26:46,156
So no, I, one of the missions I got was I did get artillery support on one mission and I
couldn't figure out, I couldn't figure out how to use it from the F10 screen because I

372
00:26:46,156 --> 00:26:47,636
didn't read the manual.

373
00:26:48,396 --> 00:26:50,456
So I'm like, okay, great.

374
00:26:50,516 --> 00:26:57,712
But no, I was, I was a single, you know, I put a lot of time into it, but I never
progressed to the point.

375
00:26:57,712 --> 00:26:59,953
Cause I actually played it on a couple of machines.

376
00:26:59,953 --> 00:27:05,667
So like I would bounce back and forth and they wanna, but yeah, mean, Brian lay it out for
us, man.

377
00:27:05,667 --> 00:27:10,420
Did we just, we just, you, you piped up that this was like the SIM that you loved four
years ago.

378
00:27:10,420 --> 00:27:15,013
And then in Denny just spent 15 minutes just uh curb stomping it.

379
00:27:15,013 --> 00:27:22,788
What, what, what, what, what, what did, what did gunship 2000 bring to the yard for you?

380
00:27:23,809 --> 00:27:29,123
Well, once multi-flight um missions open up, more mission types open up.

381
00:27:29,123 --> 00:27:34,536
Search and rescue, cargo drop, reconnaissance, that sort of thing.

382
00:27:34,636 --> 00:27:44,803
And also commanding, you command your, you command your, the members of your flight using
the same map interface.

383
00:27:44,803 --> 00:27:47,565
So you give them waypoints, you give yourself waypoints.

384
00:27:47,845 --> 00:27:53,829
And the AI for your flight is amazing because

385
00:27:54,430 --> 00:27:56,229
You tell if.

386
00:27:58,060 --> 00:28:07,678
For example, I would fly a Kiowa, you know, the one with the little radar dome and I would
go behind a hill, know, peek, peek, peek, you know, look at the target.

387
00:28:07,678 --> 00:28:20,659
And then I would give, um I would give my, two guys I was with, the two guys I was with,
the two Apaches or whatever I was with, like I would give them a couple of waypoints and

388
00:28:20,659 --> 00:28:21,850
they would just go do their thing.

389
00:28:21,850 --> 00:28:24,132
I didn't, you don't have to micro them, which is nice.

390
00:28:24,132 --> 00:28:26,023
They will just do their job.

391
00:28:26,561 --> 00:28:30,661
Like, for example, if you give someone a Blackhawk and they have to find somebody.

392
00:28:31,661 --> 00:28:34,621
Like, because there are a lot of missions where you don't know where the target is.

393
00:28:34,621 --> 00:28:43,541
That is probably my most frustrating, biggest frustration with this game is there are a
lot of, there are a lot of missions where the target is either moving and you have to find

394
00:28:43,541 --> 00:28:44,841
them.

395
00:28:45,521 --> 00:28:51,261
Oh, are great because there's only the track and that's it.

396
00:28:51,401 --> 00:28:53,685
But it's when they're moving over open ground.

397
00:28:53,685 --> 00:28:56,637
And they might hit a hill and they do, go left over the hill around the hill.

398
00:28:56,637 --> 00:28:57,988
Do they go right over the hill?

399
00:28:57,988 --> 00:29:00,009
You know, I mean, you don't know.

400
00:29:00,009 --> 00:29:07,635
So that and like search in either search and destroy or search and rescue, um, or search
and deploy.

401
00:29:07,635 --> 00:29:17,942
And so what's great is like, if one of the AI pilots is flying a blackhawk and you're,
you're, and you're, um, and they're in the light element, for example, and you're moving

402
00:29:17,942 --> 00:29:23,333
them around and they find the secondary, you give the way point, you give the blackhawk
this.

403
00:29:23,333 --> 00:29:28,886
The waypoint to where they found the guy and he'll just land and pick him up You don't
have to micro them.

404
00:29:28,886 --> 00:29:29,977
You have to them land here.

405
00:29:29,977 --> 00:29:30,957
Do this do that.

406
00:29:30,957 --> 00:29:35,430
They will just do it and so um You don't have to micro them.

407
00:29:35,430 --> 00:29:46,919
They will just do their jobs So it becomes like almost kind of a light strategy game in
the way you're moving your pilots around the map along with you And it's also nice because

408
00:29:46,919 --> 00:29:49,547
a lot of times it was a search and rescue mission.

409
00:29:49,567 --> 00:29:53,129
I love flying the Blackhawk, but I would fly the Blackhawk

410
00:29:53,204 --> 00:29:57,667
And let the other helicopter go ahead of me a little bit and let them deal with what's
ahead.

411
00:29:57,667 --> 00:30:03,801
And then I would fly in and, you know, drop the cargo or drop off the troops or whatever.

412
00:30:03,801 --> 00:30:06,493
Um, so I love doing that.

413
00:30:06,493 --> 00:30:09,735
I also love flying the, the Kiowa because it's fun.

414
00:30:09,735 --> 00:30:12,547
If it's a fun little bird to fly with the mass and everything.

415
00:30:12,547 --> 00:30:21,062
Um, and I would let, if it was a recon mission, I would like, you know, fly up to a
certain point, then send the Apaches ahead, have them deal with whatever's up there.

416
00:30:21,062 --> 00:30:22,431
And then I would fly to the.

417
00:30:22,431 --> 00:30:23,012
Recon point.

418
00:30:23,012 --> 00:30:25,057
You don't have to do anything once you get to the recon point.

419
00:30:25,057 --> 00:30:28,327
You just fly to the point and the map is like, oh, primary, you know.

420
00:30:28,327 --> 00:30:29,684
Talk about the mast, Brian.

421
00:30:29,684 --> 00:30:33,277
You mentioned that because that is the coolest feature of the Kyola.

422
00:30:33,441 --> 00:30:34,401
Yeah, it's great.

423
00:30:34,401 --> 00:30:43,781
So the, when you get a mast, either on the Kiowa or the Longbow, um, or the Apache
Longbow, uh, I believe it's F2.

424
00:30:43,781 --> 00:30:50,681
You go up over a hill, you hit F2 and the joystick, uh, goes from moving your helicopter
to moving the site.

425
00:30:51,181 --> 00:31:00,121
And that way you can target enemies from the, um, from your, uh, from the mast, they can
go back down over the hill and you can shoot.

426
00:31:00,121 --> 00:31:01,181
Yeah, no, it's great.

427
00:31:01,181 --> 00:31:01,781
It's great.

428
00:31:01,781 --> 00:31:02,395
It's fun.

429
00:31:02,395 --> 00:31:08,322
listening to this, like pop your browser open and just look up the OH 58 Kiowa.

430
00:31:08,322 --> 00:31:10,166
How do you pronounce that?

431
00:31:10,166 --> 00:31:16,825
and, and, you know, it looks, it's basically a bell 206 with this giant camera on top of
it.

432
00:31:16,825 --> 00:31:17,677
It's really cool.

433
00:31:17,677 --> 00:31:20,637
I think that's the lead designer's favorite helicopter to fly.

434
00:31:20,637 --> 00:31:25,937
And you actually get more points the lighter the helicopter you fly, if that's your thing.

435
00:31:26,657 --> 00:31:29,777
And you get fewer points if you fly a heavier helicopter.

436
00:31:30,117 --> 00:31:37,377
I didn't really fly the Comanche's because I would never remember to open the doors, you
the bay doors.

437
00:31:37,457 --> 00:31:42,517
I would never, I would never remember to do that because you don't have to do that on the
Apache.

438
00:31:42,517 --> 00:31:43,557
You just go boom, boom, boom.

439
00:31:43,557 --> 00:31:44,257
You don't do that.

440
00:31:44,257 --> 00:31:44,738
with

441
00:31:44,738 --> 00:31:48,238
With the the command, you go, oh, doors, right.

442
00:31:48,938 --> 00:31:51,518
I would never remember to open them.

443
00:31:52,078 --> 00:32:03,258
But I just love the mission variety that this game gives you with all of its helicopters,
the search and rescue, the search and search and destroy the cargo drops.

444
00:32:03,258 --> 00:32:05,378
And I also love the different theaters.

445
00:32:05,378 --> 00:32:09,358
Like not a lot of not a lot of flight sims cover the Philippines.

446
00:32:09,358 --> 00:32:11,738
And one of the flight sims cover Antarctica.

447
00:32:11,738 --> 00:32:13,938
Antarctica is a fascinating theater.

448
00:32:13,985 --> 00:32:20,885
Cause you get snow storms, get a electromagnetic interference that throws your compass
off, you know?

449
00:32:21,045 --> 00:32:25,705
And, and, um, there are also these, have you guys, did you guys ever get a deep strike
mission?

450
00:32:26,805 --> 00:32:27,245
Okay.

451
00:32:27,245 --> 00:32:33,545
A deep strike mission is interesting because you come in, your base isn't on the map.

452
00:32:33,745 --> 00:32:40,121
You come in on a certain part of the map, you flow, you flew there on autopilot, they say,
and you come in on a certain part of the map.

453
00:32:40,327 --> 00:32:44,339
And you got to get in, do your thing and get out and leave the map at the same spot.

454
00:32:44,339 --> 00:32:47,200
There's no base or anything.

455
00:32:47,540 --> 00:32:51,441
So you really have to be, you really have to manage your fuel and your ammo carefully.

456
00:32:51,662 --> 00:32:53,782
It's a more advanced type of mission.

457
00:32:54,263 --> 00:32:55,813
And those are a lot of fun.

458
00:32:55,813 --> 00:32:57,984
They're very harrowing, but they're very fun.

459
00:32:57,984 --> 00:33:03,146
um Cause sometimes there's no base to land on there.

460
00:33:03,166 --> 00:33:05,727
If, if yeah, exactly.

461
00:33:05,727 --> 00:33:07,608
Sometimes there is, sometimes there isn't.

462
00:33:07,608 --> 00:33:08,769
But those are a lot of fun.

463
00:33:08,769 --> 00:33:09,985
um

464
00:33:09,985 --> 00:33:12,225
It's fun when you use the artillery.

465
00:33:12,925 --> 00:33:18,485
I, uh, again, I'm the kind of gamer that forgets I have grenades, you know?

466
00:33:18,785 --> 00:33:22,345
So, so, uh, so I would forget I'd have artillery.

467
00:33:22,345 --> 00:33:23,305
used it once or twice.

468
00:33:23,305 --> 00:33:24,425
I'm like, oh, that's pretty cool.

469
00:33:24,425 --> 00:33:26,185
And then I'd forget I'd have it.

470
00:33:26,185 --> 00:33:31,085
So even if I had artillery, I'd be like, oh, I I've had artillery that whole time.

471
00:33:31,585 --> 00:33:35,025
Um, so this, the sin just, cause I love.

472
00:33:35,142 --> 00:33:36,822
I love blowing stuff up on the ground.

473
00:33:36,822 --> 00:33:45,094
That's my favorite thing about flight sims is bombing stuff, shooting missiles and stuff
on the ground, blowing up buildings, blowing up tanks, that sort of thing.

474
00:33:45,094 --> 00:33:46,345
And that's what the sim gives me.

475
00:33:46,345 --> 00:33:54,027
not only are your guys, the AI of your guys good, um they level up too.

476
00:33:54,027 --> 00:33:58,288
They get promotions, they get medals, they get better.

477
00:33:58,588 --> 00:34:01,148
So you really want to take care of them.

478
00:34:01,168 --> 00:34:03,827
And it's really neat if one of them gets shot down,

479
00:34:03,827 --> 00:34:08,779
Your next mission will probably be to rescue them and get them back.

480
00:34:09,500 --> 00:34:10,460
Yeah.

481
00:34:11,261 --> 00:34:11,801
Yeah.

482
00:34:11,801 --> 00:34:12,202
Yeah.

483
00:34:12,202 --> 00:34:13,322
That's very cool.

484
00:34:13,322 --> 00:34:23,077
And this game also has a lovely option that earlier Micro Pro Sims didn't, because again,
they, they want you to have fun where if you died or failed the most recent mission, you

485
00:34:23,077 --> 00:34:26,349
could use the Phoenix option and just replay it.

486
00:34:26,509 --> 00:34:33,633
And, you get a little Phoenix on your, um, on your like card or whatever in the roster and
that's it.

487
00:34:33,633 --> 00:34:36,834
You don't lose any points or anything like that.

488
00:34:36,834 --> 00:34:40,876
don't get really, you don't get any kind of penalty because they want you to have fun.

489
00:34:40,876 --> 00:34:44,978
Oh, I don't remember.

490
00:34:45,753 --> 00:34:47,659
I honestly don't.

491
00:34:47,659 --> 00:34:51,623
Yeah, you can name yourself and you can name your squad, but I don't.

492
00:34:51,623 --> 00:34:53,735
of my favorite things in really early Sims.

493
00:34:53,735 --> 00:35:01,242
And it was a feature that was quickly lost, like Larry Holland Sims had the thing where
you could name your squadron mates after your friends.

494
00:35:01,242 --> 00:35:08,308
And it's always more fun to go back and rescue Brian than it is Lieutenant Smith.

495
00:35:08,481 --> 00:35:12,577
you did that just in excellent PLT files.

496
00:35:12,577 --> 00:35:13,409
Yeah.

497
00:35:13,899 --> 00:35:15,936
Yeah, I'm not sure if you can or not.

498
00:35:15,936 --> 00:35:17,278
I never tried.

499
00:35:17,993 --> 00:35:29,246
I don't, but you know describing that kind of makes me wish I got into like to the the RTS
side of this, but you know this SIM combined with like maybe a digital integration traffic

500
00:35:29,246 --> 00:35:30,166
engine.

501
00:35:30,287 --> 00:35:34,090
Right that it would it would have been so great.

502
00:35:34,111 --> 00:35:35,573
It would have been so great.

503
00:35:35,573 --> 00:35:37,036
I can, oh.

504
00:35:37,262 --> 00:35:43,656
Brian, you know about a new SIM coming that's based on the design that is modern.

505
00:35:44,850 --> 00:35:47,390
Gunship origins, holy cats.

506
00:35:47,390 --> 00:35:53,150
Yeah, it was called, it was originally called Into the Dawn, which is why I was surprised.

507
00:35:53,150 --> 00:35:56,390
I'm like, wait, how do I already have this on my wishlist?

508
00:35:56,810 --> 00:36:07,730
But the developer of this new thing called Gunship Origins, which folks, you haven't heard
about it, go wishlist that right now, because it is basically a love letter to this, to

509
00:36:07,730 --> 00:36:08,710
Gunship 2000.

510
00:36:08,710 --> 00:36:11,990
And it looks like it's going to have a lot of the same features that this does.

511
00:36:12,245 --> 00:36:18,367
I don't know if it's going to have all the same helicopters or anything, but it looks like
it's going to have a flight.

512
00:36:18,387 --> 00:36:20,536
This guy's kind of the different pilots, the other pilots.

513
00:36:20,536 --> 00:36:26,870
It looks like it's going to have a lot of the same features, but of course, a excuse me,
I'm sorry, engine.

514
00:36:26,870 --> 00:36:28,270
And I'm very excited about it.

515
00:36:28,270 --> 00:36:29,991
Holy cats.

516
00:36:29,991 --> 00:36:34,952
I am very excited about it because we're getting a new gunship game.

517
00:36:35,673 --> 00:36:36,593
Yes.

518
00:36:37,127 --> 00:36:42,213
I love this on paper, but I couldn't get past the era of the graphics engine.

519
00:36:42,213 --> 00:36:47,756
So give me modern world building and that design and I'm in for sure.

520
00:36:47,756 --> 00:36:51,053
thing about that one is they're claiming the dev is claiming it's going to be accessible.

521
00:36:51,053 --> 00:36:55,038
Like he says, you can fly it with a keyboard and mouse because he wants every.

522
00:36:55,038 --> 00:37:07,438
favorite feature from Gunship 2000, which is when you're in the mission setup screen in
the office watching the guy write, um did you try clicking the computer of the guy in the

523
00:37:07,438 --> 00:37:08,253
background?

524
00:37:08,253 --> 00:37:13,693
of course he's playing pong or he's got the gunship 2000 logo

525
00:37:14,703 --> 00:37:16,629
Yeah, he's on a BBS at one point.

526
00:37:16,629 --> 00:37:17,841
It's awesome.

527
00:37:17,878 --> 00:37:18,918
yeah.

528
00:37:18,938 --> 00:37:21,480
Did you guys see some of the other Easter eggs?

529
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:26,762
Like there are billboards for some other, uh, microprose games in some of the maps.

530
00:37:26,762 --> 00:37:27,283
Yeah.

531
00:37:27,283 --> 00:37:28,923
Yeah.

532
00:37:28,944 --> 00:37:33,005
I think there's an F, uh, here's an F-117A billboard.

533
00:37:34,197 --> 00:37:37,328
And there's an F-22 billboard, which I'm not sure what that's about.

534
00:37:37,328 --> 00:37:41,540
Maybe that was for, what was that game that came out around this shortly after this one?

535
00:37:41,540 --> 00:37:42,251
ATAC?

536
00:37:42,251 --> 00:37:43,891
That had an F-22?

537
00:37:44,017 --> 00:37:45,072
I think.

538
00:37:45,172 --> 00:37:47,003
I never, I didn't play that one.

539
00:37:49,206 --> 00:37:53,232
That was another one of those Microprose UK creations.

540
00:37:54,370 --> 00:38:01,270
I hope one day we will play it because one of the reasons I created this show is to play
the games I missed.

541
00:38:01,350 --> 00:38:03,050
So good or bad.

542
00:38:05,250 --> 00:38:10,810
But yeah, there's just the more I play this and the more I realized it does everything I
love.

543
00:38:10,810 --> 00:38:15,290
And for some reason, the graphics don't bug me.

544
00:38:15,290 --> 00:38:23,009
I can just, it's like, I don't know if I can put myself back into 1991 or it's just.

545
00:38:23,009 --> 00:38:25,662
Doesn't bother me at all.

546
00:38:25,662 --> 00:38:27,253
you play this on mostly?

547
00:38:27,253 --> 00:38:28,364
you play this on your computer?

548
00:38:28,364 --> 00:38:31,877
Did you play it on your little Android tablet with BC emulation?

549
00:38:32,758 --> 00:38:33,499
Okay.

550
00:38:33,499 --> 00:38:42,117
I was curious if this because the graphics wouldn't look as bad on a tiny little screen,
but it's not the primitive aspect of the graphics.

551
00:38:42,117 --> 00:38:42,908
I can forgive that.

552
00:38:42,908 --> 00:38:45,488
It's just that I felt it got in way of gameplay.

553
00:38:45,488 --> 00:38:48,909
Yeah, think exactly that.

554
00:38:48,909 --> 00:38:53,011
mean, the draw distance was a big deal back then.

555
00:38:53,011 --> 00:39:02,955
I mean, you look at any 3D game from that year, either before or after, ah you get a lot
of pop-in and a very limited draw distance.

556
00:39:03,696 --> 00:39:15,036
mean, this game would have improved immeasurably for me if they had maybe scaled up the
bad guys a little bit more or did some artificial visibility things.

557
00:39:15,036 --> 00:39:25,059
Because literally, mean, you go out, you're flying around, and all of a sudden, there's an
SA-6 ah on your target list.

558
00:39:25,059 --> 00:39:32,181
You see it, it sees you, you're frantically space-barring to get over to Hellfires or
whatever to take it out.

559
00:39:32,181 --> 00:39:34,471
And it's shooting you, and it just popped.

560
00:39:34,471 --> 00:39:36,422
There it is, popped, there it is, popped, there it is.

561
00:39:36,422 --> 00:39:43,894
And I never, I wanted that experience of hiding behind a hill, popping up.

562
00:39:43,930 --> 00:39:50,864
And not, you know, I mentioned this kind of on one of our channels, like, Jesus, these
guys decision loops are like, they don't have one.

563
00:39:50,864 --> 00:39:53,586
It's like, they instantly know you are there.

564
00:39:53,586 --> 00:40:00,768
And that, that's the one thing that really bond me out is, you know, helicopters, you're
creeping, you pop up, you deal your damage.

565
00:40:00,790 --> 00:40:08,113
If it's a, you know, undefended target, maybe you'll do an overflight to chew them up with
rockets and, and the gun.

566
00:40:08,154 --> 00:40:11,015
But otherwise you're going to be doing your killing mainly from a distance.

567
00:40:11,015 --> 00:40:12,386
And the whole thing of.

568
00:40:12,432 --> 00:40:23,405
You know, as soon as you've targeted them at like some ridiculously short range, usually
less than two kilometers, they've detected you and are already sending ordnance your way.

569
00:40:23,405 --> 00:40:25,948
That and the fuel were my two biggest turnoffs.

570
00:40:25,948 --> 00:40:33,609
I could have lived with everything else, but the peekaboo, you know, gameplay to me got
really old.

571
00:40:33,609 --> 00:40:40,760
Well, if you play with the enemy on the lowest difficulty, they do react a lot slower, if
that helps.

572
00:40:40,760 --> 00:40:42,520
this is on green.

573
00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:44,920
mean, this is all the way low.

574
00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:51,820
And it's like a couple of, know, some bogeys would be like, you know, Oh, look, there's a
BMP hasn't instantly spotted me.

575
00:40:51,820 --> 00:40:57,360
But if it was like a SAM site or even infantry, it's like on the way.

576
00:40:57,980 --> 00:40:58,960
Okay.

577
00:40:59,220 --> 00:40:59,713
So

578
00:40:59,713 --> 00:41:03,997
because with me, like so many times I would target someone I'd see them go.

579
00:41:04,868 --> 00:41:05,664
Yeah.

580
00:41:06,879 --> 00:41:11,386
I creaking along about to shoot me and I thankfully hit them before they hit me.

581
00:41:11,386 --> 00:41:12,136
Yeah, I'm not.

582
00:41:12,136 --> 00:41:20,180
uh Maybe, I don't know, maybe it's something with speed or I don't know, but I found the
whole peekaboo gameplay really, really tiresome.

583
00:41:20,180 --> 00:41:23,782
Just it's like, you know, I should be able to see those guys.

584
00:41:23,782 --> 00:41:27,036
mean, and literally it is.

585
00:41:27,264 --> 00:41:32,566
It is you don't see somebody until you can target them with your selected weapon.

586
00:41:32,907 --> 00:41:36,068
Right, which to me made no sense.

587
00:41:37,025 --> 00:41:37,796
Mm.

588
00:41:37,796 --> 00:41:54,016
least the targeting aspects were definitely a bit gamey compared to reality, but it is
nice how it identified them, especially since I allowed Brian Walker's review written back

589
00:41:54,016 --> 00:41:55,236
in 91.

590
00:41:55,276 --> 00:42:00,497
This reviewer also felt that the marauding MI-24s resembled flying piggy banks.

591
00:42:00,497 --> 00:42:01,354
Hahaha

592
00:42:01,611 --> 00:42:04,613
He he he he he he.

593
00:42:04,613 --> 00:42:06,638
hard to tell things apart visually.

594
00:42:07,381 --> 00:42:15,801
Yeah, I mean, I think they did the best they could with 1991 technology, but yeah, I do
agree with you.

595
00:42:15,801 --> 00:42:19,818
It can be somewhat frustrating that you're flying along like target right.

596
00:42:19,818 --> 00:42:20,298
We're hit.

597
00:42:20,298 --> 00:42:20,948
Target left.

598
00:42:20,948 --> 00:42:21,409
We're hit.

599
00:42:21,409 --> 00:42:33,255
You know, that does get that can get and apparently that voice is a guy that just worked
at Microprose who had done some, some voice acting before, which I thought was funny.

600
00:42:33,255 --> 00:42:37,337
uh But um

601
00:42:37,577 --> 00:42:39,579
Yeah, that can get a little frustrating.

602
00:42:39,579 --> 00:42:42,693
ah It's taken me a while to become better at missile evasion.

603
00:42:42,693 --> 00:42:43,944
Let me tell you what.

604
00:42:43,944 --> 00:42:48,830
I always have my hand, like I always have my left hand on the jammer keys now.

605
00:42:48,830 --> 00:42:49,850
Always.

606
00:42:50,091 --> 00:42:52,954
Just always have my left hand on the jammer keys now.

607
00:42:53,635 --> 00:42:55,397
Just by instinct.

608
00:42:55,740 --> 00:43:01,422
I just had my co-pilot take care of countermeasures, which is another one of those
selections you can do.

609
00:43:01,443 --> 00:43:07,205
You can have your co-pilot set up to basically do everything, including targeting and
firing.

610
00:43:07,205 --> 00:43:11,207
um Countermeasures only or nothing.

611
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:17,760
I just give the backseat or something to do other call target left or target front or
target right.

612
00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:19,790
So I let him do the countermeasures.

613
00:43:20,071 --> 00:43:22,812
Pretty spammy with the flares, but.

614
00:43:22,812 --> 00:43:25,592
You kind of have to be, you know?

615
00:43:25,592 --> 00:43:30,772
Like, you know, the instant that you fly into somebody's range, you got like three IR
missiles coming at you.

616
00:43:30,772 --> 00:43:33,232
It's like, Jesus, you guys are waiting for me.

617
00:43:33,232 --> 00:43:35,072
It's like, oh, here comes Chase.

618
00:43:35,952 --> 00:43:37,392
He's almost here.

619
00:43:37,392 --> 00:43:38,812
He's flying at 50 feet.

620
00:43:38,812 --> 00:43:42,732
There's no way we should be able to see him or detect him, but there he is.

621
00:43:43,372 --> 00:43:48,652
that's, and that's again, what you're describing sounds really cool, really fun.

622
00:43:48,652 --> 00:43:52,848
just, I don't want to have to work through the...

623
00:43:52,848 --> 00:43:58,440
the warrant officer levels and then lieutenant or whatever to get to the point where I can
actually do the cool stuff.

624
00:43:58,440 --> 00:44:00,103
I'll just go play longbow.

625
00:44:00,103 --> 00:44:02,928
You know, if I, if I, if I want to helicopter fix.

626
00:44:03,009 --> 00:44:03,809
That's fair.

627
00:44:03,809 --> 00:44:08,049
And apparently there was a game that came out much later called team Apache, which I never
played.

628
00:44:08,049 --> 00:44:10,349
That does a lot of those.

629
00:44:10,349 --> 00:44:16,796
Um, lot of the same things that this game does in the, in the flood, in the multi-team
aspect.

630
00:44:16,796 --> 00:44:26,004
was, wasn't that like a weird like Team Yankee one where you had like the four screen kind
of thing seeing each each helicopter?

631
00:44:26,197 --> 00:44:28,037
I'm not quite sure.

632
00:44:28,037 --> 00:44:38,576
I just know that someone told me a while back that Team Apache did, I'd never played Team
Apache, but apparently it does a lot of the similar flight things that Gunship 2000 does.

633
00:44:40,489 --> 00:44:44,981
But I do plan to play it at some point or we will at some point, as you know.

634
00:44:44,981 --> 00:44:48,000
I feel like I tried it out back in the day, but it's been so long.

635
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:49,862
I'd have to go back and look at it.

636
00:44:49,862 --> 00:45:01,358
That actually smells earlier than this, I remember, I think it's a follow along from uh
Team Yankee.

637
00:45:02,868 --> 00:45:04,016
Now I came out.

638
00:45:04,351 --> 00:45:05,601
was from Mindscape.

639
00:45:05,601 --> 00:45:10,041
Yeah, it came out like 99, think.

640
00:45:10,281 --> 00:45:12,161
Yeah, 98, 99.

641
00:45:12,161 --> 00:45:14,121
Yeah, hang on.

642
00:45:14,641 --> 00:45:19,961
I actually have a box of it over there, but I don't feel like running over to get it.

643
00:45:19,961 --> 00:45:21,661
Not in the middle of a recording.

644
00:45:22,701 --> 00:45:24,521
It's like, yeah, 98.

645
00:45:24,601 --> 00:45:26,181
Everything was coming up.

646
00:45:26,181 --> 00:45:27,761
What a year 98 was.

647
00:45:27,761 --> 00:45:29,744
98, 99, holy cats.

648
00:45:29,744 --> 00:45:35,060
99 where that was the swan song and that was the best that it was going to get.

649
00:45:35,273 --> 00:45:37,336
it's a, it's a Simmons.

650
00:45:37,378 --> 00:45:38,259
It's a Simmons.

651
00:45:38,259 --> 00:45:39,361
It's a Simmons joint.

652
00:45:39,361 --> 00:45:41,685
Oh.

653
00:45:41,688 --> 00:45:50,768
they did, like 10 years before that, did, Domark and Simus did Team Yankee.

654
00:45:51,108 --> 00:46:01,008
And yeah, Simus, that, talk about just their, yeah, I remember trying to build a MIG-21
and FlightSim toolkit and I spent a day trying to do that.

655
00:46:01,008 --> 00:46:02,197
said, eh, fuck this.

656
00:46:02,197 --> 00:46:10,151
God, I wish they would make a flight sim tool kit now with with current user interface
progress and in a modern engine.

657
00:46:10,151 --> 00:46:11,292
That would be so much fun.

658
00:46:11,292 --> 00:46:11,652
Yeah.

659
00:46:11,652 --> 00:46:16,175
And actually Team Apache, just looked it up because I knew I was familiar with it.

660
00:46:16,175 --> 00:46:17,286
I couldn't remember why.

661
00:46:17,286 --> 00:46:23,909
And I was mentioning Brian Walker, uh who was a CGW reviewer before he became a game
designer.

662
00:46:23,909 --> 00:46:24,500
I knew him.

663
00:46:24,500 --> 00:46:28,442
I got to be friends with him later as a game designer, but this was actually his design.

664
00:46:28,442 --> 00:46:30,833
I think he left Simis before it came out.

665
00:46:30,901 --> 00:46:34,835
but he did the original design on that.

666
00:46:34,835 --> 00:46:40,681
designed by a guy who actually flew longbows, so that bodes well.

667
00:46:40,681 --> 00:46:42,416
um

668
00:46:42,416 --> 00:46:44,636
your totally forgotten publisher.

669
00:46:44,636 --> 00:46:50,173
They had their MIG-29 and they had a Harrier jump jet.

670
00:46:50,173 --> 00:46:55,473
yeah, I super VGA Harrier, uh, a while back and I really liked that one.

671
00:46:55,473 --> 00:46:56,753
I really liked that one.

672
00:46:56,753 --> 00:46:58,493
That was a great campaign.

673
00:46:58,733 --> 00:47:00,173
Oh, that side note.

674
00:47:00,173 --> 00:47:03,273
I don't know if you played that one, but you didn't even have to fly in that one.

675
00:47:03,273 --> 00:47:07,493
You could play that strictly as a strategy game if you wanted to.

676
00:47:07,493 --> 00:47:08,933
You didn't have to fly in that one at all.

677
00:47:08,933 --> 00:47:13,213
It was amazing for like 1993 or whatever.

678
00:47:13,213 --> 00:47:14,713
Like, holy crap.

679
00:47:17,017 --> 00:47:27,264
That, yeah, and they took one of their early engines and uh they did the Flight Sim
toolkit, like Danny mentioned, God, if we could have something like that, because that

680
00:47:27,264 --> 00:47:39,072
was, I'm sure we'll get into it one of these days, but yeah, could, it was a DOS Sim, so
you played the Sim you made at DOS, but the tools were all in Windows 3.1, and it even had

681
00:47:39,072 --> 00:47:40,273
a model editor.

682
00:47:40,273 --> 00:47:43,795
So when I'm talking about, yeah, I was trying to build a MIG-21.

683
00:47:44,528 --> 00:47:52,702
Yeah, I was trying to, and you had to get the, and you specified like the center of
gravity and the wing area and the whole nine yards.

684
00:47:52,702 --> 00:47:53,954
It was pretty cool.

685
00:47:54,914 --> 00:47:57,114
Flight Sim Toolkit came out in 91.

686
00:47:57,114 --> 00:47:58,734
Oh my God.

687
00:47:59,654 --> 00:48:00,774
Yeah.

688
00:48:00,874 --> 00:48:01,882
Oh my God.

689
00:48:01,882 --> 00:48:02,313
early.

690
00:48:02,313 --> 00:48:02,987
Right?

691
00:48:02,987 --> 00:48:03,783
of your time.

692
00:48:03,783 --> 00:48:05,357
Jeez.

693
00:48:05,690 --> 00:48:07,002
my God.

694
00:48:07,002 --> 00:48:08,105
same year as this?

695
00:48:08,105 --> 00:48:09,066
Same year as Gunship 2000.

696
00:48:09,066 --> 00:48:09,987
Holy God.

697
00:48:10,232 --> 00:48:11,433
Wow!

698
00:48:11,433 --> 00:48:13,775
That explains why I didn't get too deep into it.

699
00:48:13,775 --> 00:48:15,157
couldn't have done much with it.

700
00:48:15,157 --> 00:48:17,129
uh Wow.

701
00:48:17,279 --> 00:48:18,352
Wow.

702
00:48:18,789 --> 00:48:18,919
Wow.

703
00:48:18,919 --> 00:48:19,456
Yeah.

704
00:48:19,456 --> 00:48:30,444
that feels like a much later, because they had like a SVGA uh engine for it, again, that
ran the DOS, and said, yeah, wow, huh.

705
00:48:30,785 --> 00:48:31,485
know, right?

706
00:48:31,485 --> 00:48:35,465
But then, 91, my God, this is the 90s, y'all.

707
00:48:35,465 --> 00:48:42,145
If you weren't around in the 90s or you don't remember much of the 90s, was an amazing
time for these things.

708
00:48:42,145 --> 00:48:44,785
Holy, that's one of the reasons we're doing this show.

709
00:48:44,805 --> 00:48:47,524
It's because a lot of that was lost.

710
00:48:48,965 --> 00:48:50,365
Bring it back.

711
00:48:51,942 --> 00:49:01,055
Yeah, but I know just to wrap this one up, this was something I wanted to play, which
mainly because of the back of the box features.

712
00:49:01,055 --> 00:49:06,716
And so I just, I kept jumping into it when I had the time, like I'm gonna give it another
try, I'm gonna give it another try.

713
00:49:06,716 --> 00:49:11,557
And I'd play one or two missions and there would just be something in there that would
just frustrate me to tears.

714
00:49:11,657 --> 00:49:16,069
And I'd like, yeah, this is a waste of time for me.

715
00:49:16,069 --> 00:49:19,250
But God, it was, no, wouldn't be sorry.

716
00:49:19,250 --> 00:49:21,308
I mean, it's interesting going back to,

717
00:49:21,308 --> 00:49:33,168
You know, since I have never really jumped into it wholeheartedly, it's like, God, if only
we had a little bit more graphic complexity and a little bit, you know, a little bit to

718
00:49:33,168 --> 00:49:39,156
tweaks to the engagement and the visibility, it would be, yeah, I'd keep playing it for
sure.

719
00:49:39,542 --> 00:49:46,807
Yeah, I know that they tweaked the fuel because they wanted to keep the missions under 30
minutes.

720
00:49:46,807 --> 00:49:48,228
That was from what I understand.

721
00:49:48,228 --> 00:49:49,828
That was why they did that.

722
00:49:49,849 --> 00:49:51,450
And that's another reason.

723
00:49:52,202 --> 00:49:57,654
Yeah, that's another reason I like it's because it I feel like it respects your time.

724
00:49:57,874 --> 00:50:00,056
You know, I did I did like that about this game.

725
00:50:00,056 --> 00:50:03,748
Like, I like so many flight sims are like, OK, I have an hour to kill.

726
00:50:03,748 --> 00:50:06,079
So I'll fly one mission.

727
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:08,301
Maybe if I'm lucky.

728
00:50:08,430 --> 00:50:14,726
This is like you better get out and back in or we're gonna yell at you if you're out there
more than a half an hour We're gonna yell at you

729
00:50:14,726 --> 00:50:16,477
Yeah, we're going to dead stick you.

730
00:50:16,477 --> 00:50:25,741
but it's just kind of frustrating though when the, you know, the P is all the way across
the side of the map and there's no F for FARP anywhere nearby.

731
00:50:25,741 --> 00:50:29,982
It's like, yeah, I'm going to be, um I'm not going to be sweating the enemy.

732
00:50:29,982 --> 00:50:39,026
I'm, my mind's going to be so focused on my gas that I'm like going to forget that I'm
actually, you know, I've got the nose down flying 125 knots just to get there.

733
00:50:39,026 --> 00:50:44,028
So before I run out of gas, you know, heaven forbid if there's like a tank between me.

734
00:50:44,196 --> 00:50:51,373
And then I'm going to get drilled because again, with the peekaboo targeting, it's like,
yeah, who fires first?

735
00:50:53,178 --> 00:50:58,880
Did you guys, I'm gonna ask in the map mode, did you use the closeup map view to plan your
waypoints?

736
00:50:58,970 --> 00:51:00,841
Yeah, I didn't plan my waypoints.

737
00:51:00,841 --> 00:51:06,646
was like, this map sucks because there's no mountains here where it says there's a
mountain.

738
00:51:06,646 --> 00:51:11,250
And so I'm like, I read a little bit and it's like, oh, press the space bar in F10 mode.

739
00:51:11,250 --> 00:51:12,131
Okay, there we go.

740
00:51:12,131 --> 00:51:14,392
But it was like, you know, whatever.

741
00:51:15,733 --> 00:51:16,853
I did that all the time.

742
00:51:16,853 --> 00:51:23,292
It adds time and fuel usage, but I weave around hills and mountains all the time using the
close up map view.

743
00:51:23,292 --> 00:51:24,660
Yeah.

744
00:51:24,660 --> 00:51:28,592
Well, I mean, I wasn't doing, I wasn't doing stupid stuff like, there's a mountain in my
way.

745
00:51:28,592 --> 00:51:30,143
I'm just going to go over the damn top of it.

746
00:51:30,143 --> 00:51:34,254
Like, you know, yeah, I was like, I'd zip around it and peek at the edges and things like
that.

747
00:51:34,254 --> 00:51:36,045
But it's like, that's great.

748
00:51:36,045 --> 00:51:39,206
But it just ate up three minutes of my fuel.

749
00:51:40,387 --> 00:51:50,471
It's that I, so I mean, I, the peekaboo targeting, sure I could get along with, but just
combined with some of the other factors, like, um, I have gone all the way down this

750
00:51:50,471 --> 00:51:52,912
frigging train track at 125 knots.

751
00:51:52,912 --> 00:51:56,874
There is no train and things like that.

752
00:51:56,874 --> 00:52:02,176
ah But there's so much cool in here.

753
00:52:03,717 --> 00:52:06,718
Beyond trains, the targets can move.

754
00:52:06,718 --> 00:52:10,779
So it's like you get to the waypoint and it's like, where is everybody?

755
00:52:11,080 --> 00:52:13,781
But again, you're thinking of fuel.

756
00:52:13,781 --> 00:52:20,363
then there's also the, you know what, we don't want you to do this mission anymore, do
this, which was kind of cool.

757
00:52:20,363 --> 00:52:22,032
I had that happen a couple of times.

758
00:52:22,032 --> 00:52:22,322
that.

759
00:52:22,322 --> 00:52:23,464
I forgot to mention that.

760
00:52:23,464 --> 00:52:25,127
Like, yeah, go do this thing now.

761
00:52:25,127 --> 00:52:29,184
Instead of like, sometimes you're, I think, yeah, sometimes your target can change.

762
00:52:29,184 --> 00:52:30,528
I forgot about that mid mission.

763
00:52:30,528 --> 00:52:31,822
Yeah, I forgot to mention that.

764
00:52:31,822 --> 00:52:36,495
so much cool on the meta outside the actual flying level.

765
00:52:36,495 --> 00:52:39,937
That's why I wanted to keep jumping into it and just see if it would stick.

766
00:52:40,278 --> 00:52:41,899
Because there's all, Yes!

767
00:52:43,478 --> 00:52:46,283
The flight recorder is really good for the era.

768
00:52:46,283 --> 00:52:48,192
um

769
00:52:48,192 --> 00:52:56,208
can, you can, you can open up the fly recorder in the mission editor and save the mission
and edit it as an, and save it as a new mission.

770
00:52:56,531 --> 00:52:57,292
Yeah.

771
00:52:57,292 --> 00:52:57,880
Yeah.

772
00:52:57,880 --> 00:52:59,160
All this cool shit!

773
00:52:59,160 --> 00:53:10,520
If just a couple of just really teeth grindingly awful things were not there, just
engagement and visibility and a little more liberal on the field, Jesus, this thing just

774
00:53:10,520 --> 00:53:12,460
is like...

775
00:53:12,460 --> 00:53:13,480
Wow.

776
00:53:13,816 --> 00:53:15,357
I don't mind that.

777
00:53:15,357 --> 00:53:25,217
See, I don't mind that stuff because I can live with it and it does so much other stuff
correctly to me that, my God.

778
00:53:25,217 --> 00:53:27,850
Oh my God.

779
00:53:27,850 --> 00:53:30,577
Oh, but.

780
00:53:30,577 --> 00:53:32,623
how it's not how well the bun tastes.

781
00:53:32,623 --> 00:53:33,931
It's the hot dog.

782
00:53:33,931 --> 00:53:36,217
But I mean, I think it's fine.

783
00:53:36,217 --> 00:53:38,803
I think it's always fine that we don't always agree.

784
00:53:38,803 --> 00:53:41,741
I think that's what makes this podcast spicy, you know?

785
00:53:41,741 --> 00:53:42,620
So that's fine.

786
00:53:42,620 --> 00:53:48,320
because we are going to when we get to my sim, we are going to we are all going to glaze
E.A.W.

787
00:53:48,320 --> 00:53:56,460
because it is, you know, it is T.K.'s masterpiece and it is the peak of World War II sim
design.

788
00:53:56,460 --> 00:53:57,168
But, you know.

789
00:53:57,168 --> 00:53:59,656
we do have one more to go before we get there.

790
00:53:59,656 --> 00:54:00,730
Speaking of which.

791
00:54:00,730 --> 00:54:01,841
that one.

792
00:54:05,640 --> 00:54:17,002
I mean, the only thing I will get to it, I have one thing I don't like about that Sim that
I always bounce off of, but other than that, it's, yeah, save it for, don't wanna bury the

793
00:54:17,002 --> 00:54:17,752
lead.

794
00:54:17,759 --> 00:54:18,089
Right.

795
00:54:18,089 --> 00:54:31,297
So friends, uh next month we're going to move on to uh Denny's favorite flights in, which
is, and my favorite World War II flights in, which is 1942, the Pacific air war.

796
00:54:31,297 --> 00:54:35,430
And I always forget to put the, I always forget to put the, the in there.

797
00:54:35,430 --> 00:54:36,861
It's the Pacific air war.

798
00:54:36,861 --> 00:54:43,829
um If you guys haven't played that one, it's like one of the most grand World War II.

799
00:54:43,829 --> 00:54:54,322
Sims like it's got so much content like I think that and secret weapons of the lift wafa
have like the most Maybe the most content of any like world war two like my god.

800
00:54:54,322 --> 00:54:55,622
They've got so much content.

801
00:54:55,622 --> 00:55:06,345
my god you can play them for like eons and like barely run out of stuff to do because If
you haven't played 1942 pacific air war, it's got an admiral mode, which is kind of like

802
00:55:06,345 --> 00:55:12,459
its dynamic campaign basically um They basically took 1942

803
00:55:12,459 --> 00:55:17,753
task force, which is like a naval game and bolted a flight sim onto it.

804
00:55:19,327 --> 00:55:21,998
and a good flight sim.

805
00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:28,003
But not only that, you have more traditional campaigns, single missions.

806
00:55:28,003 --> 00:55:29,043
It's got so much.

807
00:55:29,043 --> 00:55:31,755
It's a huge, huge game.

808
00:55:31,755 --> 00:55:32,305
You know what?

809
00:55:32,305 --> 00:55:34,086
I'm just going to side note.

810
00:55:34,086 --> 00:55:38,929
I've got the strategy guide for both Gunship 2000 and 1942.

811
00:55:38,929 --> 00:55:45,169
There is no strategy guide for European air war, which blows...

812
00:55:45,169 --> 00:55:48,152
maybe I'm just mixing up the manual with it.

813
00:55:48,152 --> 00:55:50,033
but yeah.

814
00:55:50,033 --> 00:55:53,626
You need to get that strategy guide up there digitized too.

815
00:55:54,580 --> 00:55:56,542
I don't know if that one's digitized.

816
00:55:56,542 --> 00:56:00,535
If it's not, maybe I'll have to find a second one to send to Trickster like I did with
this one.

817
00:56:00,535 --> 00:56:04,358
um Speaking of which, just a side note.

818
00:56:04,358 --> 00:56:08,242
um The Gunship 2000 God has been very hard to find.

819
00:56:08,242 --> 00:56:14,807
I found a copy four years ago and then I just found a second copy like uh a few weeks ago.

820
00:56:14,807 --> 00:56:22,293
But good news, I sent it to one of our community members who is going to scan it, send me
the PDF and I'm going to be uploading that.

821
00:56:22,561 --> 00:56:29,861
To the internet archive so it's probably gonna be up by the time this episode goes live So
I'm very excited that you're all gonna finally get to read that fantastic strategy guide

822
00:56:29,861 --> 00:56:36,481
But yes next month we are doing Pacific 1942 the Pacific Air War.

823
00:56:36,481 --> 00:56:37,001
I can't wait.

824
00:56:37,001 --> 00:56:40,741
I love that game I love the padlock view in that game.

825
00:56:40,741 --> 00:56:43,821
I love All the content in that game.

826
00:56:43,821 --> 00:56:50,301
I love the I love the Admiral mode in that game I could I could play the Admiral mode for
just forever in that game.

827
00:56:50,301 --> 00:56:52,061
I love the Admiral mode

828
00:56:52,540 --> 00:56:54,980
And you know how much time I spent playing that?

829
00:56:56,060 --> 00:56:57,479
Zero hours.

830
00:56:57,479 --> 00:57:01,255
Whoa, oh, this is going to be interesting.

831
00:57:01,464 --> 00:57:05,524
go, definitely, yeah, I'm gonna be installing it right after we're done here.

832
00:57:05,857 --> 00:57:06,699
UGH!

833
00:57:06,930 --> 00:57:10,518
wait, you have the top recommended review on Steam.

834
00:57:11,070 --> 00:57:12,032
I do!

835
00:57:13,203 --> 00:57:16,008
And well, but it says 0.1 hours on record.

836
00:57:16,008 --> 00:57:18,598
So you just got it running and then put it away.

837
00:57:18,598 --> 00:57:18,889
I did.

838
00:57:18,889 --> 00:57:19,699
Well on steam.

839
00:57:19,699 --> 00:57:31,289
Yeah, because again, I was in that mindset of, uh, you know, yeah, I'll support the guys
that was before the, uh, because I've had the, the disc with paw.

840
00:57:31,289 --> 00:57:37,594
um there was like just a wonderful collection from micro pros.

841
00:57:37,594 --> 00:57:45,860
I think it was conquered the skies that it, yeah, it had, it had 2000, it had fleet
defender and it had paw.

842
00:57:46,133 --> 00:57:51,481
That was that was my jam and I was I've been playing that you know, like in DOS box
forever.

843
00:57:51,522 --> 00:58:00,046
So Yeah, conquer the sky would I mean that is that's a freaking smorgasbord right there

844
00:58:00,098 --> 00:58:05,278
I don't remember if the Conquer the Skies version has the expansion pack for 1942.

845
00:58:06,338 --> 00:58:08,258
I'm pretty sure the Steam version does.

846
00:58:08,258 --> 00:58:09,998
Pretty sure the Steam version does.

847
00:58:10,098 --> 00:58:16,138
I've got the 1942 gold box behind me on the shelf back there, because I love that sim so
much.

848
00:58:16,838 --> 00:58:17,226
So yeah.

849
00:58:17,226 --> 00:58:29,762
don't know, according to the steam review by, by someone named charmers, um, it says that
the, the, uh, gold version has a bollocks when 3.1 multimedia launchers.

850
00:58:29,762 --> 00:58:30,933
It does.

851
00:58:32,354 --> 00:58:44,234
It was a DOS Sim, but they wanted it to, you know, obviously when they released this, was,
know, uh ooh, let's throw on a bunch of multimedia crap on top of that.

852
00:58:44,234 --> 00:58:49,668
Dynamics did the same thing ah with the collection that they did of their Red Barons.

853
00:58:49,668 --> 00:58:52,901
And it's got like five games on there.

854
00:58:52,901 --> 00:58:53,301
got both.

855
00:58:53,301 --> 00:58:56,914
It's got all the ACES series and then Red Baron.

856
00:58:56,914 --> 00:58:59,804
And they threw on this just horrible

857
00:58:59,804 --> 00:59:06,028
you know, created in Macromedia Director with, you know, whatever public domain clips they
could find.

858
00:59:06,989 --> 00:59:09,871
And it installed the SIM in DOS mode, right?

859
00:59:09,871 --> 00:59:11,672
You weren't running it from Windows.

860
00:59:11,672 --> 00:59:20,758
For folks too young to remember, the early Windows, the 95s, 98s were all built on top of
MS DOS.

861
00:59:21,239 --> 00:59:29,814
So you would literally, in some games, the older games that weren't ported to Windows yet,
it would shut Windows down and start up DOS to run your game.

862
00:59:29,898 --> 00:59:33,566
Hehehehehe uh

863
00:59:33,566 --> 00:59:38,248
what I mean by that bollocks windows 3.1 uh installer on that thing.

864
00:59:38,248 --> 00:59:41,069
it's, Oh shit.

865
00:59:41,069 --> 00:59:43,199
Yeah.

866
00:59:43,199 --> 00:59:45,940
Did anybody actually watch those things?

867
00:59:45,940 --> 00:59:46,940
Maybe.

868
00:59:48,221 --> 00:59:52,382
No God, no, I just wanted to kick the tires and light the fires.

869
00:59:52,382 --> 00:59:56,583
And I'd already, you know, God, how many versions of that damn game have I bought?

870
00:59:56,583 --> 00:59:59,904
mean, I bought the original Bob big box of it.

871
00:59:59,904 --> 01:00:01,102
I bought the.

872
01:00:01,102 --> 01:00:02,153
Expansion for it.

873
01:00:02,153 --> 01:00:10,170
I bought the conquer the skies version of it on CD and then of course just to be complete
I picked it up on on steam.

874
01:00:10,170 --> 01:00:22,400
You'll see my reviews on a bunch of those Abandoned war games on there like that in task
force in 1942 where I'm I'm basically giving them shit and in speaking of giving shit How

875
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:24,332
dare we?

876
01:00:24,332 --> 01:00:29,335
skip the saga of Brian and the

877
01:00:29,461 --> 01:00:30,000
Oh.

878
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:33,787
Gunship 2000 distribution from Atari.

879
01:00:33,787 --> 01:00:41,000
Oh my God, we just, we almost, right.

880
01:00:41,789 --> 01:00:42,850
I forgot.

881
01:00:43,210 --> 01:00:45,052
I forgot to mention this.

882
01:00:45,052 --> 01:00:47,729
So friends, uh do you want me to tell the story?

883
01:00:47,729 --> 01:00:48,495
Do you want me to tell?

884
01:00:48,495 --> 01:00:49,075
Okay.

885
01:00:49,075 --> 01:00:49,516
Okay.

886
01:00:49,516 --> 01:00:50,737
oh Okay.

887
01:00:50,737 --> 01:01:01,476
So friends, when this, when the, when the gunship and gunship 2000 pack came out
originally in February of whatever year it was, I was so excited and like, my God, these

888
01:01:01,476 --> 01:01:02,907
are on steam and GOG.

889
01:01:02,907 --> 01:01:04,128
More people can play these.

890
01:01:04,128 --> 01:01:05,009
That's great.

891
01:01:05,009 --> 01:01:08,351
I bought them both of course, cause that's how I roll.

892
01:01:08,992 --> 01:01:10,683
I load them up and it's like,

893
01:01:11,169 --> 01:01:12,649
Who the hell are these pilots?

894
01:01:12,649 --> 01:01:13,329
What the hell is this?

895
01:01:13,329 --> 01:01:14,649
Why does it sound so weird?

896
01:01:14,649 --> 01:01:24,349
They basically like took the version from myabandonware.com, put it behind a launcher and
was like, here you go.

897
01:01:24,349 --> 01:01:29,009
And they didn't even have the manual for the expansion for Gunship 2000, just the basic
manual.

898
01:01:29,009 --> 01:01:30,889
I don't even think they had the technical supplement.

899
01:01:30,889 --> 01:01:32,909
I think they had just the manual.

900
01:01:34,109 --> 01:01:40,029
So I gave it a crap review both on GOG and Steam.

901
01:01:40,626 --> 01:01:52,291
And um, I started raising hell in the forums on both gog and steam someone from atari
eventually contacted me Directly and was like hey, what can we do to fix this?

902
01:01:52,291 --> 01:01:56,853
And I was like, I will tell you exactly what you can do to fix this.

903
01:01:56,853 --> 01:01:59,804
Here's a guy Because I bought a version.

904
01:01:59,804 --> 01:02:05,506
There's a guy on ebay who sells old games, but he he sells them I like what he does.

905
01:02:05,506 --> 01:02:07,537
He'll sell you the original cd

906
01:02:08,075 --> 01:02:13,949
But he also sells you a CD with a custom launcher he made to get it running, which I like.

907
01:02:14,210 --> 01:02:15,710
No, no, no, no, no.

908
01:02:15,771 --> 01:02:16,911
This is another guy.

909
01:02:16,911 --> 01:02:18,893
He will like for like 20 bucks.

910
01:02:18,893 --> 01:02:32,363
You bought you basically buy the original CD plus a CD with a custom launcher he built
that will install dos box or whatever version of dos or like a or a windows 95 emulator.

911
01:02:32,363 --> 01:02:35,925
Like it's he's really great because I love how he.

912
01:02:35,925 --> 01:02:39,926
Well, also he'll give you not only his installer, but the original media.

913
01:02:39,926 --> 01:02:41,567
So it's like legit.

914
01:02:41,567 --> 01:02:44,927
Um, at least I feel it's legit.

915
01:02:45,125 --> 01:02:47,388
And I'm like, go look at what this guy's done.

916
01:02:49,169 --> 01:02:57,241
and then at one point they like, I could tell they bought it and they basically took what
he did and use that.

917
01:02:57,241 --> 01:02:59,592
like, no guys, you can't do this.

918
01:02:59,592 --> 01:03:01,012
You can't do this.

919
01:03:01,112 --> 01:03:05,193
No, I'm like, guys, you can't do this.

920
01:03:05,779 --> 01:03:07,069
I know, I know.

921
01:03:07,069 --> 01:03:11,290
So, but they eventually came around and they made it their own.

922
01:03:11,931 --> 01:03:16,422
And they, they eventually uploaded the full CD-ROM version, a clean version.

923
01:03:16,422 --> 01:03:26,895
Like I think what they did was they found a version like on CD-ROM, like an actual like
CD-ROM version from like 1990, whatever, um, that had the expansion.

924
01:03:27,035 --> 01:03:30,946
And I think that, but they also fixed the original gunship too, cause that was crashing
left and right.

925
01:03:30,946 --> 01:03:33,607
Cause that was an abandoned war copy as well.

926
01:03:34,156 --> 01:03:43,529
So it took them four or five months um of badgering, but they also enlisted people like me
and some other people for internal testing.

927
01:03:44,350 --> 01:03:55,654
And after a lot of work, um it got to a point where it was playable and actually what
should have been sold initially several months prior.

928
01:03:56,395 --> 01:04:03,169
So yeah, after a lot of bitching and moaning and complaining and whining and yelling, we
got gun chip.

929
01:04:03,169 --> 01:04:05,190
2000 and gunship to where it is today.

930
01:04:05,190 --> 01:04:19,308
So I will thankfully take some credit in that it wasn't just me, but yeah, I feel very
good about doing that work because again, my favorite sim I did not want people to buy

931
01:04:19,308 --> 01:04:21,379
this on steam and go, what the hell is this crap?

932
01:04:21,379 --> 01:04:23,481
I was very passionate about this.

933
01:04:23,481 --> 01:04:26,682
I wanted them to get have a good experience like I had.

934
01:04:27,283 --> 01:04:31,765
So I I will, and I have to give the folks at Atari credit.

935
01:04:31,765 --> 01:04:33,116
They didn't have to reach out to me.

936
01:04:33,116 --> 01:04:36,487
They didn't have to do the work to get this work in the right way.

937
01:04:36,487 --> 01:04:39,468
They didn't have to do any of that, you know, but they did.

938
01:04:39,468 --> 01:04:41,529
So I have to give them credit too.

939
01:04:41,729 --> 01:04:42,769
You know?

940
01:04:42,870 --> 01:04:49,933
So, um, yeah, it took a four months, I think, but, uh, later that year they got it
working.

941
01:04:49,933 --> 01:04:53,364
I think there's a video on my YouTube channel about them getting it working.

942
01:04:53,364 --> 01:04:56,696
So, uh, yeah, so that was a fun saga.

943
01:04:56,696 --> 01:04:58,476
That was a fun little saga.

944
01:04:58,817 --> 01:05:00,016
this game coming to.

945
01:05:00,016 --> 01:05:01,316
the launcher they put on it.

946
01:05:01,316 --> 01:05:08,591
uh Now they, where you can, you can choose your resolution and get to the manuals and all
that.

947
01:05:08,591 --> 01:05:12,053
Like they did a nice job with the final version of it.

948
01:05:12,053 --> 01:05:12,688
Yeah.

949
01:05:12,688 --> 01:05:24,908
I mean, cause like before that somebody dumped 1942, task force in 1942 out there and I
gave them a bunch of help because they literally dumped.

950
01:05:25,388 --> 01:05:31,848
I don't know if it was from my abandoned where or not they literally dumped an ancient
where's distro out there.

951
01:05:31,848 --> 01:05:32,688
Um,

952
01:05:32,688 --> 01:05:40,390
that I recognized immediately made by the fact that the info files from the where's
distribution group were still included.

953
01:05:40,390 --> 01:05:43,811
And I'm like, oh my God, guys.

954
01:05:43,811 --> 01:05:51,743
And so I gave you can read my reviews on Steam and I've got comments in there and they
eventually it's been a road folks.

955
01:05:51,743 --> 01:05:58,825
There's been people who have been buying these IPs and initially they were just dumping
them out there.

956
01:05:58,825 --> 01:06:02,956
Here's DOS box, maybe it's at the right cycles, maybe it isn't.

957
01:06:03,068 --> 01:06:11,328
Um, we got the distro from my abandoned or, or for some where's distro and now with, you
know, it was like Brian here doing videos on it and shit.

958
01:06:11,328 --> 01:06:20,328
We're actually getting, okay, there's, know, there's some respect, um, you know, with
deserve it of these Sims.

959
01:06:20,328 --> 01:06:30,964
We talked about this at length on the last, uh, the last podcast with the re-release of,
you know, of, uh, ADF, but yeah, this

960
01:06:31,604 --> 01:06:40,012
where I think that should be the bare minimum of re-releasing a Sim, but at least with
Gunship 2000 now, if you go out and buy it, yeah, you're gonna get all the goodies.

961
01:06:40,012 --> 01:06:41,443
You're gonna get a decent launcher.

962
01:06:41,443 --> 01:06:54,675
if for those of you folks who are listening to Brian more than me or Denny and you choose
to buy it, yeah, you actually get something that has had a little care and tweaks put into

963
01:06:54,675 --> 01:06:58,108
it to make it, know, it's at its core, still.

964
01:06:58,126 --> 01:07:05,204
It's still just a clean copy of the SIM on DOSBox, but um yeah, it's worth it.

965
01:07:06,879 --> 01:07:08,169
That's awesome.

966
01:07:08,210 --> 01:07:09,510
That's awesome.

967
01:07:10,131 --> 01:07:10,672
Yeah.

968
01:07:10,672 --> 01:07:12,293
So that was fun.

969
01:07:12,293 --> 01:07:17,716
But it was worth it because now people can buy a the game as it should be.

970
01:07:17,937 --> 01:07:19,047
Both games, both games.

971
01:07:19,047 --> 01:07:22,460
Because again, gunship, I think gunship is worth playing.

972
01:07:22,460 --> 01:07:24,961
I think gunship, the original gunship is worth playing.

973
01:07:24,961 --> 01:07:33,367
ah Yes, we did go back to whatever episode that was where we had that discussion.

974
01:07:33,367 --> 01:07:36,128
um I think it's episode.

975
01:07:36,128 --> 01:07:36,725
them.

976
01:07:36,725 --> 01:07:50,352
Five or six maybe yeah, but still we didn't talk about gunship specifically in an earlier
episode So that's gonna do it for today my friends um Yeah, the next month will be 1942

977
01:07:50,352 --> 01:07:57,105
the pacific air war very excited about that wonderful game And don't forget to check your
six.

978
01:07:57,105 --> 01:07:59,057
Have a wonderful month everyone.

979
01:07:59,057 --> 01:08:00,278
We'll see you back here next time.

980
01:08:00,278 --> 01:08:00,438
Bye.

981
01:08:00,438 --> 01:08:01,479
Bye everybody

982
01:08:01,616 --> 01:08:02,713
Later folks.

983
01:08:03,206 --> 01:08:04,260
I'm out.